OfficeHours:ProbablePrime:2022-03-08

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Prime Time, ProbablePrime's Weekly office hours for Questions, Tutorials and Documentation and anything else that doesn't really fit.

Here are the notes from 8th March 2022

These are rough notes typed by ProbablePrime. If there are errors please edit away!

Apologies for the delay, Prime got a bit busy with MMC and current Neos events. These notes will be typed from memory as best as I can. We're working on a solution for better office hours notes soon. Meme/Joke/Repeat questions may be skipped for brevity.

Summary

Please do remember to check our Roadmaps as a lot of questions here are partially covered there. Do continue to ask them but the roadmaps are there for you to read:

Please use our Contacting the Neos Team section to reach out! Please make GitHub issues for your issues!

For security issues please read our Security Policy. For moderation issues please submit a ticket on our Moderation Portal.

Questions

Spex: Q: AnimJ raw tracks have a float value called "Interval" associated with them. It's not entirely clear to me how "Interval" relates to the global timespace of an animation. Is there any clearer documentation on this?

  • Not currently. TODO, sorry... :(

seif1: Is there currently Plans to Document the different logix node/Components actual function on the wiki?

seif1: For AnimJ, there seems to be problems with FloatQ and Matrices, is there a known way to make these values work correctly?

  • Not right now sorry, TODO :'(

Super_ray: How much time till the gui gets some new love?

  • We're constantly working on the UI.
  • Recent events slow that down for sure but do check our roadmaps for updates.

Super_ray: Can we have torrent portal added for file sinking for the sever client distribution for seshons? And to open in and out for it And Can we have the file torrent protocol added to Neos. To help servers with content distribution. And for the end users to be able to opt into it and out of it.

  • That sounds like a feature request, so please take it to the GH.
  • The torrent protocol is probably not suitable here, but perhaps things like IPFS etc might be. Check the GH for more info.

Seif1:Are the AnimJ Issues (at least with FloatQ) even known by the team at this time? I know I have tried multiple different things to get them to work, from the direct 4 value internal FloatQ inputs, to Euler angles, to general Float4, (all using the floatQ type) and it always fails to actually change the value thats being driven

  • If its not on the GH, we don't "know" about it. What I mean by that is that you might have talked about it or told a team member but we sometimes forget stuff. Please make sure a GH issue is open for it.
  • For AnimJ in general, The ToString node should show you the format the value should be inside JSON. [0;0;0;0] should be appropriate for float 4 afaik.

Duff: Will karel not be participating the judging process nor the final review stream as done in last years MMC?

  • Karel is not a judge, participant or anything. Neither were they last year.
  • Neos itself, donated to the prize fund, but that's it.

Player Kode: There has been some talk in the community about wanting to improve UX or User Experience within Neos, but what I was curious is there anything the community can do outside of what the Devs can do, eg. Interfaces, directory of 3D Assets, avatar installers, etc?

  • Ideas are totally fantastic and fine as are fully designed Photoshop files etc.
  • However, one of the problems I keep seeing and get kinda bugged about is that people assume that the problem with the UI is that we don't have a designer on our team.
  • We actually have multiple UI Designers and UX people on our team. We have ideas about what we want to do we just need to do them. Therefore the design isn't really a problem.. doing it is.
  • This is usually ignored by the community who just end up asking us to hire UI designers. We don't currently need them.
  • Additionally, some users have delivered photoshop files and then almost demanded for them to be implemented the next day. When we don't they acuse us of "Not listening".
  • Your designs and ideas are welcome, we can't take them hollistically into the product though. We need to add them to a big potion pot bubbling away to make the UI when we can.

Bisclavret: Is there a way to reset head/arm position inside of the application itself or is that a per-headset software glue thing (like openxr/steamvr)

  • I'm not sure, there might be some APIs we can use to talk to SteamVR, that's probably how programs like advanced settings etc do it.
  • I'd question the validity of doing this though as the external to neos tools are usually fantastic and work outside of neos.
  • Perhaps open a feature request on the GH if you'd like to see this.

ohzee: I believe Geenz mentioned this but they said something about the team working on the Settings menu (before well, you know, everything that's going on), any neat plans with that you can tell us about that?

  • Yup, that's the part of the UI we wanted to work on next. We wanted it modular and expandable so we can cram SOOO MANY SETTINGS IN :DDDD!

Super_ray: Can we have a help button for neos when we get to 10k active player count?

  • That's a feature request, make sure its on the GH.
  • We also have that planned. More sorta in-game support,reporting etc interactions.

Hodufan: Will the team show any kind of UI redesign teasers ahead of time or will we have to wait until the update goes out?

  • There will be options for earlier feedback yes. Stay tuned.

Super_ray: Also are “e-drugs” ok (visual overlay on the head set)

  • Make sure you're following our Guidelines and asking consent before exposing users to those objects. I personally hate them and WILL ban you if you force them in my face.

Super_ray: Can we have the book if guidelines in the essentials folder?

  • That's a good idea, but i'd rather just have it as a tab or part of the Dash itself, rather than a book. Its on our roadmap.

Player Kode: On another topic, how has Neos been doing with the Cloud Server in regards to the adding of World Creations from MMC? It looks like this year was kind of smoother imo

  • We made some tweaks last year that should have helped. As does everyone not publishing on the last day.

Pyronix: What kind of fundamentals are major roadblocks? (Regarding the UI topic)

  • One of our main roadblocks are the pieces or component parts of the UI that we want to re-work.
  • think about a button, a text box, a slider, a tab, dropdowns etc. We need those before we can make the UI work.

Hodufan: With the current state of UIX, UI features for things like drag and drop for the inventory aren't really that possible/practical. Will UI updates require updates to UIX or perhaps new features to allow that kind of interaction. I wouldn't mind a black box component for the different dash features if that meant a more fluid dashboard

  • Anything we make, we aim to pass down to you. Take for example the search bar on the dash or the page selector.... its all just UIX and you can use it!!!!

Super_ray: Can we have a whisper like ring around us that can rapidly damper the out side sound that it can help with hearing.

  • That's a feature request, head to the GH
  • However, it resembles.. our updated design for the default whisper sphere.
  • Essentially, whisper spheres gave users the wrong idea, that... whisper spheres were for private conversations.
  • While they are used this way, the... conversations are not private... Drop to another world for a private conversation.

Hodufan: One complaint I've seen mentoring new users is inventory management is real bad. If not drag and drop, what other ways of managing the inventory are on the table?

  • I spoke at this office hours for about 3 times longer than I should have that I hated drag and drop. This question was caused by that.
  • The part I hate is the Drag and Drop part of drag and drop.
  • Its a really bad paradigm. Requiring a user to hold down a control and move it just often doesn't work and isn't needed.
  • Instead I proposed a kinda "Drawer/Shelf" system where you selected say 3 folders, Hit a button once and they popped out into a floating shelf. You could most importantly drop that anywhere in usespace to rest that trigger finger.
  • Then where you knew you needed to put it, you can pick it up again and drop it.
  • It would work very similiar to how facets work, the key thing being that it doesn't require what I call a stress position to be held or the operation is lost.
  • this is just my opinion though, so Neos itself might do something else. *Shrug*, I just want to save your hands and controllers. I'm also thinking abotu accessibility. Having a vice grip on your controller is a problem.
  • I'll skip the rest of the drag and drop questions.

Bisclavret: in regards to entry legalities, i've seen questions regarding licenses for things like fonts. If a font is free license like CC-PD, is that okay?

  • I'm not a lawyer and cannot give you legal advice.
  • Read the license and contact a lawyer if you need to.

Super_ray: Will that market have an 18+ and or NSFW section?

  • Probably eventually... but... that's a separate feature request.
  • I think it will PROBABLY be: Bare Marketplace(free items) -> Item Purchasing -> Restricted Categories etc(18+)
  • How this will work is more... a moderation question though.
  • I'll skip the other 18+ marketplace questions. Please ask them at the moderation office hours.
  • Random note on the marketplace, if you ship simple stuff to the marketplace and charge big bucks for it, I'll submit it for free. Example... a basic door for $5... Nope. I'll make a free one. A beautifully textured and modeled ornate door for $5... that's fine :D.

seif1: Is all the default Neos things (the default worlds, fonts, etc) all licensed so that the users can safely use them for any projects without worry?

  • I can't speak for certain for 100%, so please ask for specific. I'd like to work with the content team to make this clearer in the future.

Hodufan: The door example is pretty simple, but how complex would something need to be before its a copy that is infringing the original author's creation?

  • I'm not sure, it's likely a case by case basis that's determined by policies and procedures we haven't written yet.

Mr_Squarepeg: Will the Neos marketplace support US dollars and other fiat based Currencies? Asking because in the past when people have asked this a certain some said "maybe". Has this changed?

  • I'm not sure, this will have to wait till the current occurences are resolved.
  • Likely Fiat though.

Earthmark: Will price fixing be allowed in the store? For instance preventing races to the bottom where users who need income to live may get priced out and forced to leave by copy cats. And How will LogiX systems be copy protected in the store, what prevents a repost of an existing system?

  • I don't know, it depends on policies we haven't written yet.

Super_ray: What is a conser that you have regarding the community?

  • i dont' remember if this one spawned the "be considerate" rant but it might have been. I decided to write that on a separate page so see User:ProbablePrime/Be considerate for that. I'll just link it regularily rather than re-typing.


seif1: How do you feel about nametags with effects, but don't HIDE the name badge? (for instance, mine does a little looping effect where it "scrambles" and then comes back, but I specifically leave the "friend-link" so that people can figure out who I am even if my name is scrambling)

  • That's fine :)

Mr_Squarepeg: Can I get the link to the "always on badges" issue on github?

Player Kode: Out of curiosity, isn't there a logix node where only the audio can be heard by the host user? I recall seeing a Neos Swag folder which had a 3D Model where a headphone plays an ambient song but it is only heard when the headphones is close to the user.

  • yeah that's just local audio, try ValueUserOverride on the audiooutput or the local only option of play one shot.

Player Kode: On a Neos questions: I did see there was a Neos Library added to the world Search Menu, is this something the Neos Team had made and is there a way the community could contribute to it growing?

  • We didn't make that, you can always see the creator of a world in the "By: <person>" line under the world name. Speak to the author of that world to contribute.

seif1: Um, where can we find funny ring that puts audio for every action?

  • Not released yet.

Electronus: why are video/audio/stream volumes not local by default?

  • We haven't prioritized this yet.
  • If you want to see it, make sure there's a GH issue that's voted up.